Author Topic: The Crusades V.1 OOC  (Read 5356 times)

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Offline DaveIronside

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The Crusades V.1 OOC
« on: December 05, 2017, 10:07:18 PM »
This is the timeline for the Crusade period.

Spoiler: Timeline • show
If we're crusadering then as a History geek allow me to throw in my proposal. However I'm not 100% up to speed on the various places as Achkaerin did all that while I was on "holiday"

1. The year is c.1090, the city of NotJerusalem is under the control of a council made up of Jewish and Islamic nobles under a "King" who believes that all "People of the Book" should be living in peace, as such for the length of his rule he has permitted Pilgrims of all faiths to enter NotJerusalem so long as they leave their weapons at the Gates. This has seen him grow wealthy.

2. Fast forward to c.1095 - The "King" dies however his eldest son is feeble minded while his second son is highly ambitious, finding support amongst extremists Muslims he begins persecuting the Jews who live in NotJerusalem and descecrating Christian Holy sites.

3. Across Mundus the power of the Catholic Church has been growing in certain nations and this has seen some royals become concerned. Believing that some nations may lead a "rebellion" against him Pope ????? determines to weaken their armies, while at the same time defending the Holy Sites. In c.1096 a Papal Bull is issued that promises any soldier who fights for the faith in NotJerusalem a place in heaven. As such thousands of potential "rebels" take up the call, including some monarchs, and head to NotJerusalem.

4. Those arriving from Albion and Eastern Ardia arrive in Mountjoy which becomes a kind of staging post for those soldiers. This helps explain Mountjoy's religious connection and it's "Order" concept. Perhaps those in Western Ardia could have gone through Neu Uburzis and then Solonia which would explain their Christian past.

5. The first Crusade lasts until around 1100 when the city of NotJerusalem falls and the Crusader Knights proclaim a King of NotJerusalem who is supported by the Pope. The King rules with an iron fist, restoring religious sites and expanding them. Pilgrims begin once more to flock and many soldiers remain taking over land from the defeated enemy.

6. In around c.1105 the King of NotJerusalem experiences a schism when the Pope refuses to appoint the King of NotJerusalems choice for Archbishop to the position. This splits the Crusaders who stayed in the Holy Land and a series of scuffles breaks out amongst the two factions. The Muslim contingent in the region see this as an opportunity and launch an offensive of their own, creating a three way battle.

7. Eventually the fighting turns into a stalemate between the three factions, The Conference of (insert city) takes place and the two Christian factions reconcile their differences coming to an agreement about future appointments and the rights of the King and Pope over the city.

8. The newly united Christian faction experiences a series of defeats and is pushed from the city. A new tolerant Muslim leader takes control and agrees to open the city to people of all faiths along similar lines to what originally existed. The Christian Knights are permitted to keep their territory in exchange for promises to not rebel. Most agree.

9. In c.1130 The Muslim leader dies and a new Pope proclaims that the Knights old promises are no longer valid. He begins urging them to take back the Holy Land and a Siege of the city of NotJerusalem begins soon after.

10. Sensing an opportunity the Jewish community sides with the Christians and within two years they have taken back the city installing a new King. The new King forbids Muslims from entering the city however Jews are permitted.

11. In c.1135 at Passover a Blood Libel is spread stating that the blood above Jews doors is the blood of children. As such a great massacre of Jews begins in the city seeing thousands brutally put to the sword, the KIng attempts to stop this only after one of the cities Synagogues is burnt down damaging a neighbouring Church.

12. The Jews now convinced they will eventually be pushed from the city begin a secret deal with the Muslims who begin raiding Christian pilgrims and trade caravans.

13. By c.1137 the Muslim army has advanced towards NotJerusalem and lays siege to the city. Three weeks into the siege a Muslim assassin is let into the city through secret paths by a Jewish rebel, the King is slaughtered without an heir leading to confusion in the Christian ranks. The siege lasts two more weeks before the city is stormed and capitulates easily. The Muslim leader executes several hundred Christian Knights belonging to certain orders.

14. Despite the brutality of the war the new Muslim leader establishes a new council made up of three nobles, a Christian, a Jew and a Muslim. Christians and Jews may live peacefully in the city so long as they pay an extra tax and refrain from certain public actions during Ramadan. This appeases most of the citizens who live happily.

15. One of the Orders whose Knights were executed however want to seek revenge and begin co-ordinating with the others to begin a new war.

16. By c. 1148 the Orders have built up their strength and funds and without the Popes backing launch a series of raids in the Holy Land.


17. The Pope sends word to NotJerusalem that these soldiers do not have his blessing and excommunicates them. In the months that followed a Pope backed Christian Army marches to the Holy Land and a stand off begins between the two Christian factions with the Muslims watching from the city.

18. The Alliance of NotJerusalem begins after the Pope backed Army arrives. This sees the Rebel Christian Armies rank and file execute their own leadership in exchange for being welcomed back into the Church. The Alliance then begins controlling the area around NotJerusalem in an uneasy peace with the city itself controlled by Muslims. This lasts for around 20 years and during this time their is the odd raid but nothing major.

19. In c1168 a new Pope is under fire for not taking enough interest in NotJerusalem, as such he orders that the city must have a Christian leader. He orders a Knight called ???????? to begin negotiations with the Muslims to find a peaceful solution, however ??????? is killed by brigands while travelling. His body is found by Jewish traders who see a chance of being able to return to the city and so they tell the Christians they witnessed a Muslim faction do this.

20. c.1170 word reaches the Pope of ??????? death and in response the man is made a Saintly Martyr. A new Crusade is called in his name and thousands flock to the Holy Land once more. A series of campaigns are fought and by c.1178 the Holy Land is back in Christian hands. A descendent of ??????? is appointed as King of NotJerusalem and without the Pope's backing he takes a Muslim wife in order to unite the two factions.

21. In c1230 the peace is shattered when a Christian "Cult" begins in the city which the King (descendent of c.1170 guy) fails to deal with the Cult. This Cult believes the 2nd coming of Christ is close and that will happen only once NotJerusalem is only inhabited by Christians. A great slaughter takes place as a large number of the populance rise up against their neighbours and even the Christian soldiers who seek to protect them.

22. Despite the Cult being put down with a week news reaches the Muslim and Jewish leaders who both march on NotJerusalem to seek vengeance. Along the road their armies fight a small battle which ends in a stalemate, the two rulers agree to work together rather than fight and in c.1235 a combined Jewish/Muslim army have reached NotJerusalem.

23. c.1240 the city of NotJerusalem is on the verge of falling, the Pope however offers a deal. He will not agree to send further armies should the Jews/Muslim alliance permit soldiers to leave the city and never return, the new ruler permit a Christian on their council and the Holy Sites be protected by members of approved religious orders (maybe this would explain why a small contingent of the Order of Mountjoy is still permitted to stand guard in NotJerusalem.)

THE END.


V.1 will focus on points 3 & 4, as the story progresses other V's will begin hitting on other points which may or may not change.

Certain nations clearly fit into this storyline better than others, for example ES & Mountjoy. However TIO has always been open and I think this could be an interesting addition to the main RP so rather than conjuring up ways of your nation which may have no interest in the situation to get involved can I suggest that perhaps people create characters like maybe a Knight or resident of the city.

Essentially this is set in Vanora which is our Holy Land, featuring Jerusalem. Map wise the nation will be moving to south of Abydos which will be part of the story-line in future RP.


Offline Achkaerin

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2017, 12:12:47 AM »
Key point map wise moving forwards is this - Abydos and Vanora are swapping places with the territory of w8 being switched to P51 this will close the distance between south east Vanora and Mountjoy while preserving geographic position for already established Great War canon events. Also bear in mind that after the Crusades that in accordance with the factbook that Vanora at some point comes into being say so I'd suggest that for future reference the last name of the original Christian representative hinted at at the end of timeline Dave's put up be Aragon therefore establishing the presence of the future ruling dynasty for the purposes of the Duchy if that's ok. Or we adjust the timeline to birth Vanora at the end of the Crusade era.

Anyway other key point Vanora is essentially a straight up copy and paste of Israel but reversing the religion dynamic in terms of Jewish majority, Christianity minority so Christian majority, Jewish minority so that needs to be borne in mind and remember there's no holocaust in Mundus at present time. So we can either assume this has always been the case or work that as part of the massacre by the Cult later on.

And so everyone knows I'm intending on getting Vanora's map done on Thursday, when done will be posted here for reference purposes.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2017, 12:57:19 AM by Achkaerin »

Offline The Young Pope

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2017, 08:47:23 PM »
Rob, if you're online and have the time, need to discuss with you regarding my 2ndary Balticum in Discord, something which will surely interest you!

Offline RobertAgira

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2017, 09:05:24 AM »
I think we need to start considering the numbers etc being thrown around.

Logistics in the medieval period were extremely difficult for a start so moving tens of thousands of men around the world is going to be tricky.

The RL 1st Crusade saw an estimated 35,000 Crusaders. Already we have a contribution of the following if I've read correctly.

ES - 50,000
AT - 1,484
Mountjoy- (Still "recruiting") likely to be around 5,000

At present we're also likely to have other factions not mentioned involved, so for example Satan's nation is supposedly very Catholic, UC has a significant Christian minority, as do places like Dartfordia. It would be safe to assume large numbers from there would also be making their way to join up. I'd guess therefore that by the time we're done we'd see a Holy Army of close to the 80,000 mark, more than double that of the real life Crusades. Keep in mind that sending a large army means that you'd have very little left back home for maintaining law and order, collecting your taxes, defending against raiders etc.

It's estimated the largest ever army during the Medievel period was during the 100 years war when the French raised around 50-60,000 soldiers, however they were on home soil and so easier to deploy. The Holy Roman Empire, which had around 80 000 – 100 000 soldiers before the Third Crusade, is possibly larger but this was used in more of a border defence and policing with a much smaller portion of it carrying out campaigns.

Remember also population changes, the average population compared to medieval times is 3.9 times higher (E.g France today is around 69million, estimates of 17million at this time). So you don't have the modern manpower, so for example ES wouldn't have the 300+ million it does now, it would have around 90million. Therefore the army must be significantly smaller. Consider the opposition has at present Vanara's medieval population of around 2.8million, and Abydos 24million (assuming the 3.9 difference), they'd likely be steamrolled based on the numbers forming so far.




Online Norgeras

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2017, 03:55:03 PM »
I intend to send roughly initial 600 men. I think that is enough for now.

Offline Achkaerin

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2017, 04:17:02 PM »
Aragon's order comprises 500 men, by the time we get towards the end of the Crusades that may be between 1000-1500 people, they will likely also be added to with another 800 coming from elsewhere. But that's only for the final parts of the timeline.

Offline Markus

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2019, 11:45:09 PM »
Ok, so I am trying to get Tamora involved in this someway (as in actually fighting). I have to say the whole timeline is a little daunting at first. So are all 23 points canon and established or just the first four points? I am asking since I want to come up with some suggestions where (in the timeline) Tamora might participate.

Offline Achkaerin

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2019, 11:49:49 PM »
I believe (Dave may correct me if I'm wrong) that all 23 points are canon in terms of the timeline, I if I recall correct the now dead IC thread relevant to this i.e. "V1" was initially focusing on the first four points before moving on.

Offline Markus

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Re: The Crusades V.1 OOC
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2019, 06:26:33 PM »
Ok, so the Muslim side of the war is represented by Abydos and whatever local Muslims forces were in Venora, right? I mean there are no other countries that have been established as fighting or offering support to the Muslims, right?